tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post8404824689559057417..comments2024-02-10T23:32:15.095-08:00Comments on TRISHUL: The Indian Navy’s CIWS SagaPrasun K Senguptahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comBlogger34125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-6485033835858163962009-10-14T10:19:01.755-07:002009-10-14T10:19:01.755-07:00one thing we should understand that in CIWS CATEGO...one thing we should understand that in CIWS CATEGORY there is a group defence system and point defence system.<br />point defence system is designed to kill target coming to hit your ship while group defence is for portecting a consort or other ships also if any missile is fired on it ..... kashtan is a point defence system and barak-1 is a group defence system. if we see the technlolgy of operation both system are designed for differnt approch ..kashtan is maintainence intensive system while barak's failure rate are severe but still kashtan is better than barakAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-71956674831212114132008-10-18T23:28:00.000-07:002008-10-18T23:28:00.000-07:00Power output:10kWFuel: Kerosene/LPGMass flow rate:...Power output:10kW<BR/>Fuel: Kerosene/LPG<BR/>Mass flow rate: 0.13kg/s<BR/>Compressor pressure ratio: 3<BR/>Turbine inlet temperature: 900 C<BR/><BR/>SMALL GAS TURBINE ENGINE<BR/>(Straight Jet)<BR/>(Thrust = 2.25 kN, SFC =1.1 kg/hr/kg)<BR/>340 mm diameter* 670 mm lengthAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-63234298648425393222008-10-18T23:16:00.000-07:002008-10-18T23:16:00.000-07:00Here are some details of the engine for cruise mis...Here are some details of the engine for cruise missile.<BR/><BR/>ETBRDC propose to develop into and Aero-engine house of international level in the years to come. Several projects are being envisaged to be taken up.<BR/>A twin spool Turbofan Engine is being proposed to power a Cruise Missile under design. ETBRDC will jointly develop this engine with NAL and GTRE. The engine is small; the technology involved is as complex as any bigger engine. Since the usage is for missile application, no external help can be sought and the engine has to be wholly indigenous. This is a challenging task and ETBRDC is confident that it can meet the challenge.<BR/><BR/>http://164.100.24.208/ls/CommitteeR/Defence/17threport.pdfAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-66749870078226107442008-10-18T23:04:00.000-07:002008-10-18T23:04:00.000-07:00I am reasonably certain talking to DRDO people tha...I am reasonably certain talking to DRDO people that there is Rustom MTOW 750kg turboprop powered.<BR/><BR/><BR/>I will try to do google search on new GTRE micro gas turbine engine.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-76330682177969692302008-10-18T01:33:00.000-07:002008-10-18T01:33:00.000-07:00I don't have the figures with me.I don't have the figures with me.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-83295095639823873942008-10-17T02:16:00.000-07:002008-10-17T02:16:00.000-07:00RE PrasunCan you tell the weight of Barak-2/8/NG m...RE Prasun<BR/><BR/>Can you tell the weight of Barak-2/8/NG missile, as it will help us in comparing it with other missilesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-66948324707240102292008-10-15T23:45:00.000-07:002008-10-15T23:45:00.000-07:00trishul was deficient on three counts you said,wha...trishul was deficient on three counts you said,<BR/>what is the third count prasun? you mention only two.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-10266683668139066882008-10-15T09:13:00.000-07:002008-10-15T09:13:00.000-07:00To Raj@1:45AM: The Rustam will be piston-engined, ...To Raj@1:45AM: The Rustam will be piston-engined, while the other two UAVs planned for indigenous development--Gagan MALE-UAV & Pawan low altitude long endurance UAV--are planned to have turboprop powerplants to overcome the problems of crosswinds that have imposed severe flight restructions on the Searcher 2 and Heron 2 under certain operating conditions and low & medium altitudes. <BR/><BR/>Regarding turbofans for cruise missiles, I'm not aware of the existence of any programme at GTRE/NAL to develop such engines and the only engine developed to date by GTRE for such vehicles is the PTAE-7 turbojet. Anything smaller and more efficient than the PTAE-7 will have to be a turbofan like the 36MT from NPO Saturn.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-59891409668989300532008-10-15T01:45:00.000-07:002008-10-15T01:45:00.000-07:00Re PrasunThere are two variants of Rustom, One has...Re Prasun<BR/><BR/>There are two variants of Rustom, One has MTOW of 600kg and second with (turboprop?) engine has a MTOW of 750kg. <BR/><BR/>Also there were lot of brouchers posted of small turbojet/fan engine being developed for cruise missiles on BRF (can't seem to locate it now). Which was a smaller engine than PTAE-7 for Lakshaya.<BR/><BR/>Re FINSAS-Iknow about it a bit but am not able to get any info on the new rifle and sniper rifle under developmentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-84553088405434379432008-10-14T21:16:00.000-07:002008-10-14T21:16:00.000-07:00just some simple background would do sengupta. wha...just some simple background would do sengupta. whats important is the xcellent content and not the backgrounds.<BR/><BR/>but yes we gotta weed out the porkistani colorAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-26774051822260413212008-10-14T13:40:00.000-07:002008-10-14T13:40:00.000-07:00Prasun, you need to change the background color fr...Prasun, you need to change the background color from paki green to something more eye pleasing... it is a pain to read with green background<BR/><BR/>thanksAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-32960657573605554202008-10-14T13:18:00.000-07:002008-10-14T13:18:00.000-07:00To all the beauties!!@12:46PM: In essence, the Tri...To all the beauties!!@12:46PM: In essence, the Trishul SHORADS project served as a good learning curve, so it is not all a case of 'sunken costs'. Regarding the Rustam, the ARDE has already come up with some Rotax-type piston engines that were displayed during DEFEXPO 2006. You can get data on the Rustam from NAL's website.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-31518973048870551582008-10-14T12:48:00.000-07:002008-10-14T12:48:00.000-07:00whats next whats nextwhats nextwhats nextwhats nex...whats next <BR/>whats next<BR/>whats next<BR/>whats next<BR/>whats nextAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-89173301677573975922008-10-14T12:46:00.000-07:002008-10-14T12:46:00.000-07:00HI so what are the further plans of Trishul when t...HI so what are the further plans of Trishul when there seems 2 b no scope 4 it anymore??..<BR/>So thats how Rustam got its name.... <BR/>Is it only the airframe design that was bought out? How bout d engine? <BR/>thanx for keepin us updated buddy.... <BR/>Ur efforts are highly appreciated... <BR/>Please keep the good stuff coming....Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-31362701109871121072008-10-14T11:53:00.000-07:002008-10-14T11:53:00.000-07:00To Anon@11:36AM: No need for any moles as the Indi...To Anon@11:36AM: No need for any moles as the Indian Navy at that time did a fairly good job between 2002 and 2004 of briefing the press with dates and related data pertaining to the Barak-1 procurement. Regarding the MALE-UAV, the first prototype of the 'Rustam' is being prepared for flight-tests. It is actually the Light Canard Research Aircraft, an experimental model (the Rutan Long-EZ) whose design was bought outright by the National Aerospace Laboratories in the early 1990s from the US-based Rutan Aircraft Factory.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-16732225415305270332008-10-14T11:37:00.000-07:002008-10-14T11:37:00.000-07:004. Oh ya - So whens FINSAS gonna be ready?4. Oh ya - So whens FINSAS gonna be ready?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-4178240780496884592008-10-14T11:36:00.000-07:002008-10-14T11:36:00.000-07:001. Barak deal was a big scandal and thats all. Lam...1. Barak deal was a big scandal and thats all. Lame excuses were given for Suresh Nanda and gang to make money.<BR/><BR/>2. Out of topic but speaking about UAVs hows DRDOs plan to make a MALE? Ay progress<BR/><BR/>3. Finally, excellent analysis. How is the info available to you? I mean you r saying exact dates of letters and all.. you must have a mole :-|Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-15764840271781305842008-10-14T11:08:00.000-07:002008-10-14T11:08:00.000-07:00To Raj@10:35PM: The FINSAS project is not just abo...To Raj@10:35PM: The FINSAS project is not just about developing a family of new-generation firearms, but about making the future infantry soldier fully functional and more lethal within a digital network-centric encironment. Therefore, more emphasis is being placed on developing not direct-fire weapons, but indirect fire support weapon systems which will be fired by mechanised infantry forces from the secure confines of an APC or AIFV, but will be guided to their targets by loitering mini-UAVs. The mini- and micro-UAVs, on the other hand, will also be launched from APCs or AIFVs or even by hand (in case of micro-UAVs) will be tasked with target acquisition/designation even for Platoon-level or Squad-level operations. In other words, the FINSAS project will revolutionise and redefine the very concept of infantry-centric combined arms warfare. Several such technologies are already being tried out in Afghanistan by the Germans, US and British forces under real combat conditions.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-24726597185372038982008-10-14T11:00:00.000-07:002008-10-14T11:00:00.000-07:00To left wing nut job@10:42AM: ARDE is developing g...To left wing nut job@10:42AM: ARDE is developing glide bombs that could also be fitted with add-on laser seekers or GPS receivers to convert such standoff weapons as PGMs. ARDE is also trying to develop 300mm MBRL-launched rockets with 120km-range (an enhanced Smerch-M, so to speak). But to date, no other data has been released by ARDE in the public domain (such as during DEFEXPO). Maybe during next February's Aero India 09 expo something more would be unveilled, such as conceptual drawings/posters/illustrations or photos of functional prototypes.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-3555936955607197852008-10-14T10:56:00.000-07:002008-10-14T10:56:00.000-07:00To Austin: It will therefore be interesting to see...To Austin: It will therefore be interesting to see what additional capabilities the combination of EL/M-2248 MF-STAR/Barak-1/Barak-2 will offer with regard to hard-kill interception options against inbound supersonic ASCMs. In any case, when I was in Israel last year I was told by both IAI/ELTA & RAFAEL that a novel sensor-fusion solution (combining RF/optronic sensors) originally being developed for the Barak-2 will now also be incorporated into the Barak-1, whose engagement range will also be increased by 15%. For the Kashtan-M the Ruskies are nowq proposing a modular upgrade under which the principal target acquisition/engagement sensor-cum-fire control system will be a navalised NO-11M Bars PESA radar coupled to a PHOENIX IRST. This solution was originally developed for the Pantsyr E-SHORADS meant for export to the UAE.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-8936726735547141142008-10-14T10:47:00.000-07:002008-10-14T10:47:00.000-07:00To Prasun: The reason why AK-630M is not effective...To Prasun: The reason why AK-630M is not effective is because it lacks a closed loop guidance/control . hence it cannot make fine correction to take care of low flying sea skimming missile.<BR/><BR/>The idea of AK-630M is just to create a wall of lead against incoming target and hope it does damage.<BR/><BR/>As far as dealing with supersonic anti-ship missile , I think its only the russian which claim that Kashtan-M can effectively deal with it , but like all russian claim we need to take it with a bag full of salt.<BR/><BR/>The only way one can deal with supersonic AShM is go for a layered defense , any CIWS/Hard kill option will be too close for comfort.Austinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06768100357737947086noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-11424018127127491062008-10-14T10:42:00.000-07:002008-10-14T10:42:00.000-07:00Thanks Prasun for this article and the note on IN ...Thanks Prasun for this article and the note on IN pursuing SeaRAM. Also, thanks for the additional line space between paragraphs.<BR/><BR/>Recently, I became aware that ARDE is in the process of developing (with an outside partner) a family of munitions. Would happen to have any more information on that program?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-76371178153816031472008-10-14T10:22:00.000-07:002008-10-14T10:22:00.000-07:00To Anon@7:49PM: In the early 1990s the DRDO sort o...To Anon@7:49PM: In the early 1990s the DRDO sort of gate-crashed into the process of weapons procurements process and convinced the MoD that unless the DRDO did an independent audit of the projected requirements to find out whether such weapon systems could be produced indigenously, weapons imports from abroad would not proceed. In other words, what the DRDO actually wanted was more access to R & D funds so that the IGMDP targets could be fulfilled, and mind you all this was happening when the country was facing a financial crisis. But the main problem then was that the DRDO could not supply indigenous solutions within the required time-frame. Hence, when the shit hit the fan in mid-1999 the Navy was already in dire straits. In fact, since since 1996 when the US exported three P-3C Orion Update 2.5s along with AGM-84 Harpoons the Indian Navy had already sounded the alarm bells. But the Govt of India and its MoD turned a blind eye to this. That's why the Navy's desperation increased to an all-time high when faced with the prospect of all-out naval war in the northern Arabian Sea. That is the main and only reason the then CNS Admiral Arun Prakash was gunning for the Barak-1. Everything else being speculated about his involvement in promoting only the Barak-1 at the expense of other available CIWS is pure nonsense. In any case, why should IAI or RAFAEL try to bribe a CNS who had already been convinced long ago about the operational requirement for Barak-1? Logically, the only ones who needed to be bribed were those civilian decision-makers within the MoD whose consent and approvals were required to make the Barak-1 procurement a top priority and therefore convince the Union Ministry of Finance to give approval for establishinbg the Price Negotiations Committee ASAP. <BR/><BR/>To Austin: The AK-630 family of six-barrelled guns are indeed used as CIWS but not specifically as anti-missile defence systems. These guns, when used simultaneously against as inbound anti-ship missile like those of the Termit family, are moderately effective (but not more than 60%, according to Navy firing trials way back in the 1980s and 1990s), but, like the Vulcan Phalanx, are absolutely useless against present-day sea-skimming anti-ship cruise missiles like the MM-40, A/R/UGM-84 or C-802A. And when it comes to intercepting supersonic anti-ship cruise missiles, the only viable solution today and in future is the hit-to-kill anti-missile missile. The latest version of the Kashtan-M's missile round is touted to have a range of 22km, but that's not what the Indian Navy is procuring.Prasun K Senguptahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00369323150694008798noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-36134630584920260962008-10-14T03:48:00.000-07:002008-10-14T03:48:00.000-07:00is this your company???????http://www.trishulgroup...is this your company???????<BR/><BR/><A>http://www.trishulgroup.com/index.htm</A>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5154280302945875495.post-45693642363185591882008-10-13T22:45:00.000-07:002008-10-13T22:45:00.000-07:00I think you forgot to mention the oldie AK-630M wh...I think you forgot to mention the oldie AK-630M which is the most widely used CIWS in the IN.<BR/><BR/>Future IN ships will have a combination of Barak-1 and a advanced variant of AK-630M ( perhaps the AK-630M1-2 ) as standard CIWS.<BR/><BR/>Its possible few Russian built ships may come with Kashtan-M CIWS if they shove that off our throat.Austinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06768100357737947086noreply@blogger.com